iGaming Daily

Fernando Noodt (00:02.148)
We might not be Slim Shady, but we have to snap back to reality because SBC Summit Rio 2025 is now in the books and we have to keep moving, keep reporting and keep doing this lovely podcast called iGaming Daily. Welcome everybody. My name is Fernando Nott, Senior Business Journalist for SBC Noticias and your host for today's episode of iGaming Daily. And I'm joined by...

SBC Noticias Brazil editor Ricardo Assis. Ricardo, how are you today?

Ricardo Assis (00:33.944)
Hey Fair, happy to be here and rest because of the carnival. So all good.

Fernando Noodt (00:39.3)
Yeah, yeah, we had like a taste of the carnival during SBC Summit Rio, but we had the actual carnival right after. that was great timing for SBC Summit Rio 2025. And how did you enjoy it Ana Maria Menezes, Business Journalist for SBC Noticias Brasil?

Ana Maria Menezes (00:59.573)
Hi, Finn. Always glad to be here. And Carnival was actually a pretty peaceful time for me. I didn't go to the parades, but I did rest a lot. And I was actually able to recover from busy days at the summit. It was great. I enjoyed it a lot. And yeah, I'm looking forward for the other events during the rest of the year.

Fernando Noodt (01:23.384)
Yeah, have America's coming up for sure in two months now. Wow. Time flies. Time really flies. But what about you, Ricardo? Did you go to the parades, to the carnival parades in Sao Paulo? Or did you just stay home?

Ana Maria Menezes (01:27.381)
Yes!

Ricardo Assis (01:36.558)
I just went to the beach with my wife and my son and rest in the pool doing some barbecues so was really just chilling around

Fernando Noodt (01:46.756)
Yeah, repairing experience, bet. Very much needed after a very busy event. How did you guys like SVC Summit Rio?

Ricardo Assis (01:56.342)
It was very good. I was able to do a lot of interviews, get new sources, so it was really productive and the panels were really good as well. I went to see five of them and they were all very clarifying in some very important matters in the industry here in Brazil. And I think as a whole, it was almost perfect for me because I was able to meet a lot of people that I need to meet and I was

to tackle some topics in person that I need to tackle with some people so it was really really good.

Fernando Noodt (02:33.006)
This was actually your first SBC Summit Rio for both of you. So I bet it was a different experience because you are always like trying to speak in English with other people or in Portugno like that mix of Spanish and Portuguese. So it's like an extra effort for us non-native English speakers to like adapt and speak in a different language. But for you guys, this was in your native language speaking in Portuguese with all the delegates. Actually,

Ana Maria Menezes (03:01.601)
Yes.

Fernando Noodt (03:02.848)
Some delegates didn't even speak English, they just spoke Portuguese. But what was your experience, Ana?

Ana Maria Menezes (03:10.505)
As Hikaru said, just talking face to face with people is a whole different experience. And I do believe that's one of the many great parts of our events. The fact that you're able to simply just approach a person and say, hey, do you mind if we talk for a couple of minutes? And scheduling as well, we do have our app, SPC Connect. So just being able to schedule meetings and have that face to face interaction, it just creates a whole different communication and relationship with other people. So it was very

and having that in Portuguese was great for me, it was amazing and the fact that I could... I mean, when we have different languages being spoken at the same time, it's hard. I mean, you're changing between English, Portuguese and Spanish sometimes, especially in our events when we're talking to other Latin Americans. So sometimes it's a bit of a challenge to keep yourself posted to that. It's a challenge, but it's a rewarding one as well. It's a rewarding one.

So being in the summit and being able to communicate fully was very rewarding, but it was challenging all the same because you still need to create connections. And creating connections is fun, but it can be challenging because you're talking to people and people are different. So it's a fun challenge. It's still a challenge, but it's a fun challenge and I enjoyed it a lot. So it was a great experience overall.

Fernando Noodt (04:38.082)
And I said back to reality, SBC Summit Rio is over, but we've been yapping about the event for the last four minutes. Sorry, Anaya McDonald, our producer, who we know is very jealous for not being in the event, but let's move on. Let's go to the information we are here to report on. But first let's thank OptiMove, the number one CRM marketing solution for the iGaming market and sponsor of iGaming Daily. And like we mentioned last week,

Ana Maria Menezes (04:44.348)
Yeah.

Fernando Noodt (05:05.732)
in the episode we were in, pretty much every delegate at the SVC Summit Rio had a great interest in marketing. Like that was a big topic discussing marketing campaigns, discussing marketing strategies. And of course, responsible gambling is major priority for the industry, how to properly promote your business and like balance that need to promote your business. But

keeping it responsible so you're not like always showing your brand and saying like doing promotions in an unresponsible way, let's say. But there's actually something very interesting this week because it looks like the Congress has taken note of what has been in discussion in SVC Summit Rio and a new initiative has reached the Chamber of Deputies.

Ana Maria Menezes (06:00.693)
Yes, so Kim Katagiri basically he has proposed a bill to make promoting illegal gambling a crime and if this passes along anyone caught advertising unauthorized betting sites could face from one to four years in prison and plus data fine. So the penalty would double if the promotion would target kids or teenagers so people under 18 years old and this is something that is very it's a big

concern as it said by congressmen before congresspeople sorry and also the bill also cracks down on influencers so this was actually a topic a very big topic for us during the summit so how influencers and other public figures use their status to promote websites and how to do that responsibly in a responsible way and how to do that according to the law and here's the thing we already have ordinances we already have laws concerning that part

So there's also the question of how much these penalties and how much this congressman that are actually the ones who came up came especially right now came up with this idea, et cetera. Just how much.

we could think of an option of already making what we have better instead of creating something new. So this is actually a good reflection if we think about it, because we already have ordinances and we already have laws concerning this part of advertising. So this is something that we maybe should think about for the future. But yeah, the topic of advertising for gambling sites and doing it in a responsible way is the biggest

We are still on the lookout for the land-based casinos. But since we already have the approvals, we need to learn how to do that in a safe way for the influencers and for the companies. So it does make a lot of sense, but we do need to work with the resources that we already have. And instead of keep creating

Ana Maria Menezes (08:18.741)
new layers to something that we could maybe take advantage of because it already exists. This at least in a more on a personal note with that approach.

Fernando Noodt (08:28.088)
Yeah, I think it's very interesting your mentioning the things that already exist, but because this topic is definitely not the first time it's been addressed, Ricardo, specifically about how companies are responsible for the influencers and what they do that was actually influencers were also a major topic during SVC Summit Trio. this is not a first for Brazil.

Ricardo Assis (08:53.102)
Yeah, this is something that's been discussed already in the Law Ordinance 1231, that's the ordinance about the responsible gambling.

and it's defined that the operators are responsible for what the affiliates and the influencers do and the way that they do and I agree with Anna, I think it should not be another a new law it could be an addition, a new ordinance or addition to the ordinance to after the one that already exists it would be it would make more sense than having to go to the deputy chambers and the senate to go all through another new law

Regarding this I think it should have more than fine It shouldn't be only fining people. think doing it Processing people in a criminal way is something that makes sense for me at least I think this is something that would make sense to to do but I think the way that the this is being proposed is not the correct way because we already have a Law we already have ordinances and I think it would be faster. It would be quick

it would be better if it would stick to the law that already exists and add things to it.

Fernando Noodt (10:08.708)
I feel it'd be like a waste of resources, especially considering that Brazil is actually, like Ana said, working on land-based casino regulations. So it definitely feels like a bit of overkill, but it wouldn't be a first for lawmakers. I was about to say a lot in America, but I would say the world. Like lawmakers usually tend to like propose bills.

Ana Maria Menezes (10:32.801)
Yeah.

Fernando Noodt (10:37.942)
on top of other builds that say kind of the same things. So it's nothing new for the gaming industry. But going back to influencers, Ricardo, what is or what do you see as a Brazilian based in Brazil? What do you think the general audience thinks about influencers? How does the media portray gambling influencers in Brazil?

Ricardo Assis (11:04.451)
Well, I think because of the investigations that we had last year, the image is not so great at the moment. We had some problems with that. But I was talking with some operators and some people of the industry during the summit. And the problem with this affiliates, the ZipFlicers are not so much the bigger ones are the micro ones because the micro ones are the ones that reports or sorry, not reports.

that does the adverta... sorry.

Ricardo Assis (11:41.421)
Micro, okay, sorry.

Ricardo Assis (11:46.497)
I was talking with people in the industry during the summit and they said to me that the problem is not so much the bigger ones because these ones are the ones that are being well fiscalized because they have a lot of followers, they are appearing a lot but the real problem are the micro-influencers because these are niche influencers and they do not have the same level of fiscalization on it.

I was talking with some people that think that the government should create a channel that people would be able to report this kind of misbehavior. So that's a way to tackle it in my sense. But the general view, in my opinion, it's not the best because these ongoing investigations have been tarnished the image of the sector as a whole.

Fernando Noodt (12:44.834)
Yeah, when it comes to public image, we have said this before, the industry needs to take the first step, needs to be proactive. mentioned, specialists mentioning this actually during the summit, but the industry, regulating industry can take the first step, but the government also needs to take their measures and allow or provide the tools for both legal operators and the public in general.

to report on this. I think that will be a very helpful tool. And we will talk about a very important change to one of the key groups in Brazil, which has been very proactive in this sense, which is the IBJR. But that will be just after this very brief commercial break. We will be right back with iGamingDaily to speak about the changes in the IBJR.

commercial play.

Ricardo Assis (13:41.145)
Woohoo!

Fernando Noodt (13:42.028)
Okay.

Ricardo, don't put your hand to your face when you're speaking because your voice sounds kind of like... Yeah, yeah, yeah. No worries. Yeah.

Ricardo Assis (13:52.119)
It's buff, it's mephos a little bit. Yeah, okay. Sorry.

Ana Maria Menezes (13:56.257)
Wait a minute, let me just...

Ana Maria Menezes (14:01.323)
Sorry, it's too hot here. Okay.

Fernando Noodt (14:02.308)
Okay, let's go.

We're back with iGaming Daily. Thank you very much for waiting, but we were just discussing how important responsible marketing is, how responsible marketing strategies are mandatory for successful operations in Brazil and everywhere else, right? But we were mentioning how the industry needs to remain proactive, how the industry needs to work first before restrictive regulations come like it happens in a lot of places before.

And a very important actor in this sense has been the IBJR, which has just announced a change in their lead, a new change in the director of the IBJR.

Ana Maria Menezes (14:51.361)
So Fernando Vieira is the new director of IBJR as we say in Portuguese.

And Elisa Marcanti, our business journalist, has been able to talk to him directly as an exclusive interview with him to talk a little bit about his job, how it's going to work out, and how he sees the gambling industry as well. So how he actually sees his next steps forward as the executive director of IBJR. And this is something that is very important because IBJR is one of the leading

Institutes when it comes to law law ordinance so they do have a lot of power with the government and it's very important to know who's in charge and who's in who's in the lead of that This is why we wanted to interview him and to understand his views about the gambling industry so And Elisa gave me and I'm gonna give it to you guys just a sneak peek of what you guys can expect from this interview and you can already check that out in our website on the Jesus

especially in Brazil.

It's already available there for you guys and just check that out. But just as a sneak peek, we talked a little bit about how Ibex Jai helped the market to improve in Brazil, how can how institutes can help the government to make better ordinances and better laws to help the industry and not push it back and take steps back. So this is a great topic to talk about.

Ana Maria Menezes (16:30.637)
And this is something that the industry has been talking about for quite some years now. Also the impact of the leadership change on the industry right now, especially with the change of the regulation market. So this is also something. So changing this right now in March, in the beginning of the regulated market, what does it mean? What do you see for the future? So we tackle all of these subjects in our interview that Elisa Marcanti did with

Fernando Vieira, the new executive director of IBJR and you guys should definitely check that out. It's pretty important to us as Brazilians to understand who's in the lead of our industry and to look forward to the future.

Fernando Noodt (17:15.8)
Yeah, make sure you visit SBC Noticias Brasil and subscribe to the newsletter so you don't have to wait for us to let you know these things happen. You can just get it straight to your inbox. So subscribe to SBC Noticias Brasil newsletter to get all this in your directly into your inbox. But I don't think we mentioned what Ibejo Taeri stands for, which is Instituto Brasileiro de Jogo Responsável, which is

the Brazilian Institute for Responsible Gambling. there you have it. But as André Gelfie mentioned in his farewell post, this organization has been or were pioneers in self-regulation, in taking the first step, in being proactive, like we mentioned. So especially related to marketing, mean. And as such, they partnered Conar in a very early stage, Ricardo.

Ricardo Assis (18:10.421)
Yeah, are. They were. Sorry. They are and they were. And so they are... They created the code of... Sorry, I'll go back again. They created a code of auto-regulation embedding and they published it in May of 2023. And with this code in mind, the Conar created an xx which is the...

Fernando Noodt (18:14.584)
Yeah, yeah.

Ricardo Assis (18:40.001)
The laws that... It's not a law because it's the... Yeah, rules, because it's not... They can't enforce it. So, with this code... Yeah, guidelines, I think. Yeah, it's better. They created this code.

Ana Maria Menezes (18:44.712)
rules.

Ana Maria Menezes (18:50.879)
guidelines.

Ricardo Assis (18:56.425)
in auto regulation and this became the footprint of the NXX which are the guidelines for the sector in publicity. So they are very active in this manner in creating guidelines and good practice for all the companies in the sector.

Fernando Noodt (19:16.494)
Yeah, I think it's key to be self-regulated first to create your own guidelines so you can like as an industry work together to be responsible in your advertising so you are not too aggressive with your marketing campaigns because that only generates the government to come after you and say, hey, you cannot advertise at all. But if you actually have a self-regulation and...

get together with the rest of your peers in the industry with your competition and say, hey, we need to like set these guidelines, these ground rules. So let's not overstep, let's not over limit, like let's not exceed ourselves with advertising so we don't get like that negative push from the regulators. But despite these joint efforts, of course, there has been a...

lot of work done but there's still a lot of work to do still in Brazil because the industry remains in the spotlight when it comes to responsible advertising.

Ricardo Assis (20:22.822)
Yeah, so the Conar has released its report regarding the publicity here in Brazil in 2024 and we had 188 processes that ended with companies being penalized and 42 of this process were... 42 of this process...

42 of these... Ah fuck, sorry guys. 42 of them were to bedding companies, so 22%, which are the sector that were penalized the most. And also, there were almost a thousand notifications to...

agencies, influencers, regarding the publicity of betting, which are the most by any sector by a mile. But I think this is something that was to be expected because the sector has been working without regulation for a long period and this was a year of adaptation and also

only 11 of these processes were regarding brands that have the license now. So the majority of the companies that were penalized were companies that are not operating regularly, are not operating in the regulated market. So this is something that we need to take into account. So I think in 2025, this number tends to be way lower because...

Most of the companies already know how it works. They know that if they do something that the government and the Conar judge wrong, they can be penalized, they can even lose the license. So I think this is something that we need to see as positive because it's good that they are fiscalizing this. I think it's good that they are putting light into these problems.

Fernando Noodt (22:26.434)
Yeah, it's definitely necessary that they do. And we will continue to report on this. We will continue to follow the new developments in Brazil. And you can follow all of this and more on SBC Noticias Brazil. So make sure you are subscribed to the newsletter. You can also follow iGamingDaily on TikTok. We are now on TikTok. we can make sure you follow iGamingDaily Podcast on TikTok. So every time you go to bed.

You can see our lovely faces or every time you are eating or doing something else, you can also see our lovely faces and get up to date with the most important information in the iGaming industry. Thank you very much, guys. It's been great talking with you again. Thank you very much, Ania MacDonald for producing this episode and to all our listeners out there. We'll catch you in the next one. Goodbye.